@wyrmeboi As a second point of debate, what gives you the right to discard the votes in the state primary elections?
@sirgeefive We all have watched older relatives or friends in decline. The successful agers do great late in life... until they don't. Thereafter the path of decline is very steep. That is my experience. The primary votes were cast before the worst of his decline became apparent. Also, 2/3rds of voters now say he should be step back. That also is a mandate.
@wyrmeboi "The poll of 1,253 adults was conducted July 11-15, 2024, using a sample drawn from NORC’s probability-based AmeriSpeak Panel, which is designed to be representative of the U.S. population. The margin of sampling error for all respondents is plus or minus 3.8 percentage points."
So, 2/3 of 1,253 people that AmeriSpeak was able to poll answered in the affirmative. This is nowhere near 2/3 of voters. Polls really can't be trusted. See the last election for proof.
@sirgeefive Right, well, you are asking me to tell you what all voters think? I can't obviously. But I can tell you what I heard canvassing today, as I walked the pavement, or what I hear in the political office I work in, and what recent polling says. Oh, and while I can't tell you what internal Dem. polling says, I can tell you that both Schumer and Jefferies talked to Joe about stepping back after they received that internal polling. You can figure out what it showed them. #politics
@wyrmeboi No, I am countering your point and saying that you are not speaking for all voters. You are using a poll, many of these are incorrect, inconclusive and funded by oligarchs. The only thing I have asked of your is your personal justification for your statements. I have asked you stop using the arguments of others as proof as they are not your arguments. Why are you not referring to Trump at all? Why is your only focus on Biden?
@sirgeefive Oh. I have a doctorate in Neuroscience from the University of British Columbia. I earned that PhD working in a psychology department.
@wyrmeboi So you are a neuroscientist attempting to make a professional diagnosis?
@wyrmeboi I think you might want to check out the Goldwater rule.
@sirgeefive And I am not saying he should be set aside. The electoral votes are his. But saying we should not encourage him to step aside, and voluntarily give up control of the electors, or even have a debate about it, is insane. We lose with Joe. Period. I think we win with a younger candidate. The kids will come back.
@sirgeefive Nancy Pelosi thinks this, Hakeem Jeffries thinks this, and Chuck Schumer thinks this, and so do many others. AOC does not.
@wyrmeboi Are you getting your opinion from the people you listed here, or are you forming your own? I am confused. It might be all the triangulation.
@sirgeefive I form my belief based on multiple sources. As anyone should. I take all available data points (that I deem trustworthy) and compare them to my cognitive model of the world. If they don't fit my model, I revise it.
@wyrmeboi You are replying to my statement saying that if you don't know Biden personally, you are forming your opinion based on the statements of others. I believe you and I are saying the same thing. You are not qualified to diagnose the President. Your diagnosis is therefore not worthy of debate or discussion.
@sirgeefive I am not giving a diagnosis. Enough with that straw man. I am giving a political assessment. If Joe stays at the top of the ticket we have less chance to win than if he steps down. The rest was simply showing my work. I canvass, I organize, and I run a political office. I talk to actual voters that are not in my bubble of relationships.
@wyrmeboi There is no straw man here, I have addressed every one of your arguments. I am not attacking you, I am attacking your arguments.
Who are you proposing take his place with around 100 days left until the election? What is your solution?
Again, why no Trump in your discussion?
@sirgeefive I mentioned Trump in the second post. I used the word "aberration", rather than his name, because saying his name makes me angry.
The straw man is that you have twice questioned my right to provide a diagnosis. Strictly, "cognitive decline" isn't a disease, and thus can't be diagnosed, so you aren't even using the word "diagnosis" properly. But to be clear, I am not trying to provide a diagnosis, but rather, a political assessment.
@wyrmeboi How is pronouncing cognitive decline a political assessment?
What is your solution?
You have Trump who is clearly far worse than Biden who is running with a united party. On the other hand, you have Biden, who is clearly much clearer than Trump who is running with a divided party due to intentional media manipulation by Peter Thiel and other billionaires. You have donors admitting that they are pushing the "dump Biden" movement, and you have detractors who are helping.
@sirgeefive Sigh. It's not a matter of whether he can govern. It's a matter of whether he can communicate clearly enough to win. I don't believe he can. I would love another 4 years of quiet, competent governance. But I believe that if Joe stays, Trump wins, and (based on a poll I haven't even seen, but infer the results of) we lose both the House and the Senate in the process due to low turnout. #politics
@wyrmeboi What is your solution? I know I keep repeating this question, but it is an important question. Without a solution, a person would simply be promoting chaos, which I imagine would indeed cause lower voter turnout. This is why I spend the time to argue with people that I assess as willing agents of chaos. No solution is a clear sign of people attempting to dissuade.
@sirgeefive There us a process if a candidate steps down. The dem have a convention. It would be a contested convention, and for 3-4 days candidates would vie to win the 3900 pledged delegates that Joe had. I suspect that Kamala Harris would win. Then she gets to pick her VP. I read an article that made the case for Senator Mark Kelly.
@wyrmeboi That doesn't get people past the state filing deadlines.
How do you stop all of the people that you just disenfranchised by discarding their primary votes from leaving the election entirely? Your concern is low turnout, so by disenfranchising the people who voted in the primaries, you are telling them that their votes don't matter.
I disagree that Biden is a loser. I think the losers here are the people falling for a Thiel campaign.
@sirgeefive solution? A younger vibrant candidate. That probably will be Kamala Harris. That would be fine with me. Her numbers are tainted with young voters by association with Joe, but I think she can overcome that. Someone just suggested Pete/Gretchen; great combo. Super good, but the congressional black caucus will make a stink.
@wyrmeboi Ok, so I am going to look past the obvious ageist stuff here and humor you for a moment. Harris is currently the vice president. She will automatically become president if something happens to Biden. Suggestions of candidates who have not filed to run are nice in a pipe dream, but we are around 100 days out to the election. Biden proclaims a 230 million dollar plus war chest. Do you think these other unannounced candidates can get the fundraising? How about getting on ballots?
@sirgeefive Harris gets to use that money, even if Joe steps down, since she is on the ticket that raised it. Other candidates don't. It's a good argument for going with Harris.
@wyrmeboi Again, how about getting on ballots? Ohio is contesting Biden being on the ballot due to him not making a filing deadline.
Why not just support Biden? He already has a backup ready if he is unable to perform the job. That backup is your preferred candidate due to her age. If you spent half as much effort supporting the ticket as you do being a detractor, do you think you could help sway some voters who have been influenced by this deliberate Thiel campaign?
@sirgeefive I do support Biden, in a professional capacity. But I am saying that I don't believe that we win with him, and that the party would be better served to find an alternative right away. I have already explained why I think we should make that change: in short he won't win, and so Kamela will not be VP. She will not be available to step in. The ticket is a loser because they have alienated 10-15% of their voters who won't come back for Joe.
@sirgeefive Professionally, I am 100% on the script. I support Biden and tout his accomplishments at doors, but voters are telling me what they think. I am relaying that message. What I say on counter-social won't have any impact on this election at all, so I don't see what you mean by "detractor".
@wyrmeboi Well, Stephen, I appreciate you having a civil discussion with me. I believe that we are going to go back and forth and neither of us is going to convince the other. I will support the Democratic ticket no matter what, but I strongly support Biden, and I can see through this "dump Biden" scheme very easily. I hope that you have a great day.
@wyrmeboi You are referring to 2/3 of voters. Can you show me actual data rather than conjecture? I will also again ask you what your qualifications are for diagnosing a person with a decline in cognitive functions? What doctorate do you possess? So far as I know, most professional doctors refuse to diagnose a condition without seeing the patient in person.