Okay, here's a problem I'm faced with that advice from strangers might actually help with. I am charged with becoming a BSA merit badge counselor in an area I am well qualified in. However, for me to be an official "Adult Member" of the BSA they require me to sign off on a Statement of Religious Principle". I do NOT concur with said statement.
Your thoughts?
@Boyceaz Hate to break it to ya, but BSA is a religious organization. Always has been. I left for the same reason that you're facing when I was a teenager.
Just look at their own words on this page:
https://www.scouting.org/awards/religious-awards/
I have no business telling anyone what to do. But you need to reconcile yourself to it if you want to be involved.
@Boyceaz don't do it. period. never sign anything you do not fully align with, especially where religion is concerned. especially with an organization with a history of child abuse. and thats coming from a former boyscout.
Hmmm. If you can afford to take this to court…
“ The Boy Scouts of America maintains that no member can grow into the best kind of citizen without recognizing an obligation to God and, therefore, recognizes the religious element in the training of the member, but it is absolutely nonsectarian in its attitude toward that religious training. Its policy is that the home and organization or group with which the member is connected shall give definite attention to religious life.”
1/2
IMHO it gets down to “what does nonsectarian mean” — that in itself is a squishy thing. Does “nonsectarian” include or exclude atheists and agnostics?
BSA won in Boy Scouts of America et al. v. Dale which allowed them to exclude queers. I can’t see them NOT winning on the religion angle. UNLESS you can argue that “nonsectarian” isn’t a REQUIREMENT to believe in a god or gods. (The use of God argues it is an Abrahamic version of religion so it’s arguably that is nonsectarian). 2/2
@feloneouscat @DyDave @C_H_Antony @Animeraider @fuse @Idissent Excellent advice all. COSO is really the best community of folk.
My plan is to see if if MB Counselors are truly required to join. If so, I'll find someone else who can sign the thing and serve in the role.
@Boyceaz @feloneouscat @DyDave @C_H_Antony @Animeraider @fuse
And I want to apologize, after seeing it explained by another user, I agreed with how she (I think, I can't remember who it was) put it and yes, you should do what works for you
@Idissent Don't doubt yourself. You gave excellent advice. You said you could not do it, and that is totally valid.
@Boyceaz
Thank you but seeing how it was explained made perfect sense
@Boyceaz I guess I'd have to read the statement. If I could somehow blend my own principles I might sign it.
@BillieBun I don't know how to link to it here, but @feloneouscat just reposted.
Also, just talk to them. It may not be that big of a deal.
I knew a couple who were lesbian but were Orthodox Jews. Not a problem to their Rabbi.
People can be accommodating.
“Its policy is that the home and organization or group with which the member is connected shall give definite attention to religious life”
This is what you should bring up — the national chapter DOES NOT REQUIRE it. More of a suggestion than a rule, IMHO.
If the group you are attached to doesn’t think it’s a biggie, then according to the BSA, it’s not a biggie.
That’s your out.
My 2c FWIW:
If signing the statement is a requirement, and you don't agree with the statement, then you can't in good conscience meet their requirements and it has to be their loss 🤷♂️
@Boyceaz agree with what others have already shared. If you don’t agree, don’t sign. Make it their problem/loss.
@Boyceaz who is “charging” you to become a BSA merit badge counselor? I have worked with scouts over the years and assisted with kids getting badges without having to be the adult member because while I think scouts does good things for some kids it does bad things for the kids it rejects.
@HannahRayJones I'm a member of a professional org that is sponsoring a merit badge day where we expect to train 75 scouts in our discipline. I'm the only member of the org in my town where the event is to be held. So I volunteered. That said, there will be at least 15 other adults that could potentially be the MBC.
@Boyceaz Same problem faced by addicts in recovery when the twelve steps include surrendering to a higher power. The org may have roots in established religion and a particular view of how to get there, but did leave enough room for you to choose what for you is a religious experience and what if any guiding principles that might lead you to adopt. Could be an omniscient sky being, could be art or nature.
However, the fact that BSA is structured to steer children into churches is still there
@Boyceaz
I couldn't personally