@voltronic wonder if the Lenovo site has a refurbished section

@dratino
They do, on the Lenovo Outlet. I looked there already and everything in my price range or even bit above has soldered RAM, and / or low-res displays.

So far nothing seems to be approaching the value of the refurb t480s.

@voltronic arstechnica dealmaster lists this guY:

https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/p/laptops/thinkpad/thinkpadl/l13-gen-2-(13-inch-amd)/21abs02s00?orgRef=https%253A%252F%252Fevents.release.narrativ.com%252F

I don't suppose that would serve

@rpardee
8 GB non-upgradeable RAM rules it out. Too bad, because otherwise it would be good. Maybe I can find a similar model. I love to try one of the mobile Ryzen processors.

@voltronic @rpardee

waiting patiently for lenovo to stop soldering RAM onto the mainboard

@KAutumnrain @rpardee
It's for cost saving I'm sure, and when corporate accounts are buying pallets of these they don't really care that you're locked in at 8GB because they're going to rotate them out after a couple years anyway.

@voltronic @rpardee

Oh for sure. Additionally, 8 GiB is getting a little tight these days but it's not the end of the world for a laptop especially.

@voltronic @rpardee

(Naturally, depending on what, exactly, you're doing with it.)

@voltronic ThinkPad is the closest thing to those requirements. I purchased a refurb T480s last year or 500$ with 1TB HD and 24GB ram and it is my freebsd daily driver.

@voltronic

@matuzalem @voltronic

check out matuzalem... running FreeBSD on the desktop...no wait...FreeBSD *BETA* on the desktop...

😎👍

and yeah volt...the T480 was the last great thinkpad...I had one...the T500s were a step down in build quality (IMHO)...and the initial P series (P50) were super shitty build (my current n-1 laptop is a P50)

@opie @voltronic Tried windows 11 and Linux mint. Everything works fine with the T480 on those OSes, but I can't stand not to use FreeBSD when on a PC. It has all the tools I want.

@matuzalem @voltronic

I scratch that itch by sshing to my many fbsd boxes from my linux laptop... 😁

@opie
ICYMI, I just ordered the exact model @matuzalem has. It will be a Win11 machine mostly, but I'll put WSL on it for Linux funsies.

@voltronic @matuzalem

this is me 😐

😜😁

@voltronic T480s

@matuzalem
May I ask where you got it and how much you paid?

@matuzalem
I think I just found it.
https://a.co/d/12qJHj8

@voltronic that's the one and the place

@matuzalem
Think that one's my winner winner chicken dinner. Thanks!

Is that 512 GB SSD an NVMe?

@voltronic NVME all the way, some people add an M2 to the WWAN slot, but I don't want to increase the heat, so I just swapped it with a 2TB kit from iFixit.

@matuzalem
Oh, it uses the 2230 form factor?

@voltronic yes https://bjm.me.uk/blog/thinkpad-t480s-ssd/

@matuzalem
Ordered! $357 seems like a good deal even if I have to replace the battery. Hopefully it's in otherwise "excellent" condition as stated.

Did you find the display to be rather dim? That seems to be the main complaint in reviews, but this thing is rarely going to leave my house.

@voltronic display is dim, but even with my dying eyes, i find it as a feature in these days of too darn bright displays that keep us awake at night. lol

@voltronic check out Clevo laptop frames. They’re sold in bulk to other companies who buy parts, put it together, and sell to consumers

Sager is one such company. My laptop is a high end Clevo frame specced out by Xotic PC’s, but there are low end Clevos that might give you what you need for less $

I don’t know if the keyboard is high quality but I like it

I only paid for 32 gigs of RAM and got 128 (Black Friday lol)

It has high end ssd slots for days

->

@voltronic

Downsides:

Not sure about business-work-oriented laptops, but the gaming laptops can be big and have LOUD FANS

But it also has a driver that lets you control performance and fan speed and stuff so I have been able to switch from doing spreadsheets and browsing on quiet and low performance mode, then launch my modded-to-hell-and-back Skyrim and put on some headphones.

Relatedly, the speakers kinda suck according to audiophiles, but… y’know… headphones.

@voltronic

Of interesting note is that they are constructed in a kinda old-fasioned way for laptops - they’re made to be kitted out by third parties, so they’re rather upgradeable, and that also means they’re rather repairable.

Not quite on the same level as Framework laptops (maybe look into those, too btw), but certainly WAY better than, say, a MacBook air or even your average HP.

@voltronic

Oh hey yeah the Framework 16 came out, this is totally something you should look at

Two m.2 slots
Expandable ram up to 64 GB
Good keyboard… at least according to Linus Tech Tips :/

(BAHAHA autocorrect just tried to change it to Linus Tech Rips)

Anyway, you can choose to have a numpad or a macropad or both and swap em yourself as needed (or fancy RGB or extra touchpad junk)
Good screen
Optional dedicated AMD graphics card (because screw NVIDIA)

And it can come with windows

@voltronic

Super-ultra-mega-big-upside: EXTREMELY repairable and customizable. Like, they sell parts explicitly for repairs. And it’s stupid easy, by design. The company culture is centered on being not like Apple, basically. They are hardcore supporters of the right to repair.

You customize your I/O, too, using these little I/O modules. They can serve as memory cards, too.

They even have a community of people making custom oddball ones.

@voltronic

I'm also pretty sure they release updated hardware to upgrade with. So that'll help future-proof their laptops.

@voltronic I'm really enjoying my Framework laptop, which meets or exceeds all your requirements.

Totally repairable, and customizable. In fact, you can pick and hotswap the ports to what you need at the time.