So, you disagree, that we don't live in a Socialist country that has Capitalist ideals? 🤔

@IshMaelOz

@Heucuva8 i'm open to persuasion (always) but i think we live in a capitalist country with some socialised services/infrastructure. I would prefer a Keynsian model of all natural monopolies being publicly owned and all essential services free at the point of delivery. What do you think?

I can appreciate the beauty of that model. I'm in favor of all the basics for survival being free at POS. This includes things like Housing, Water, Healthcare, Safety (Police, Fire, etc), I also believe that there are few/NO companies capable of self-regulation. I also believe that a Representative Democracy is expedient, but not sufficient to express the will of the people. There is no reason why one family should have Billions of dollars while others can't afford to be food-secure. @IshMaelOz

@Heucuva8 i don't object to 'reward for endeavour' in principle but in an ideal world that would be based on value rather than price. For example: we would notice if garbage collectors, teachers, nurses etc were absent for a couple of weeks, but not the CEOs of most organisations. As such CEOs are arguably less valuable and would therefore earn less. Add to that, around 60-ish% of all wealth is inherited...and the concept of working for financial advancement is redundant. Cont...

@Heucuva8 In terms of representation of the electorate: there are immediate improvements we could make. Voting is compulsory here, adding 3-5 key policy questions to a ballot paper would be a low cost option for soliciting public engagement without involving party politics or ideologies. Vive la Revolution!

@singlemaltgirl In the 1950s, we went through something called the Red Scare. Sort of a Witch Hunt, but for "Commies". This push was led by then-Senator Joseph McCarthy, thus McCarthyism. This lasted basically through the entire Cold War. Since our "Enemy" was the "Union of Soviet SOCIALIST Republics" Americans conflated Socialism with the USSR.

@Heucuva8 This, combined with decades of Conservative demonizing of both Communism and Socialism (because they support Capitalism and deregulating EVERYTHING),
Communism/Socialism = Commies = Russia = Authoritarianism.
It's partly why Conservatives to this day believe the Nazis were Socialists. It has it in the name, so add them to the list of "Commies".

@Heucuva8 i would get that IF americans didn't seem to be the least worried about trump loving putin & talking very positively about 🇷🇺. nor do i see great backlash when it's been pointed out 🇷🇺 's interference in 🇺🇸 elections, or social media influence or ANYTHING really. but mention 'socialism' & americans go nuts.

trump has never been vilified for loving & complimenting russia & never lost any support. fox news is talking about how russia is 'ousting nazis from ukraine' & 🇺🇸 lap it up????

@singlemaltgirl That's the power of spin doctors. You have HUGE corporations all dedicated to pushing the Conservative agenda, like Fox News and OANN. It all comes together when you use Apologetics to flip public opinion.
The Right will do ANYTHING to have something to rub in the Left's face, or "Own the Libs".
And ANYTHING they do is justified if it leads to those ends.

@Heucuva8 It's like this...for Fascism to gain power, your enemies must be simultaneously Weak and Strong. They are Weak enough that your in-group mocks then, but Strong enough that they Fear them.
We saw this with the BLM protests during the Summer. "Antifa" (whom the Right believes is just a Left Wing KKK for Black people) are both "Soy Boys" thus victory is assured, and "Antifa Supersoldiers", so the in-group stays motivated and on task to "defeat" them.

@Heucuva8 Combine this with a culture of Gun Fetishization perpetuated by the very corporations that PROFIT from the political strife, and conflating gun ownership with "Manliness", and you have a recipe for Authoritarianism. All you need is a Charismatic leader figure to whom they can pledge loyalty to and identify with and you get ̶N̶a̶z̶i̶ ̶G̶e̶r̶m̶a̶n̶y̶ ̶ 2016- Present America.

@Heucuva8 so contradictory. hate socialism b/c evil but the authoritarian communist state is an ally? i never thought 🇺🇸's would ever get over their hate & fear of 🇷🇺. not in my lifetime. cold war was ~50 yrs? to see trump openly invite & praise 🇷🇺 = so weird.

& putin is no gorbachev.

i think of the 🇺🇸 💜 for things like freedom, going against the 'man', socking it to big corps, supporting the underdog, occupy wall street, etc. hating socialism that works w/ capitalism makes no sense to me. sigh.

@singlemaltgirl And NOW since you see the pieces coming together, add in QAnon. Pushing disinfo, for the explicit purpose of being the Single Source of "true" information. They also sow enough conspiracy theories (especially Lizardmen ones, and this thing with Liberal celebs all being in a powerful Cabal that stays young by raping and killing children to drink their blood in the basement of a pizza parlor that doesn't even have one), that it's disorienting and causes cognitive dissonance for the in-group (solved by only listening to "True" News, and Gaslights the "Enemy".

@Heucuva8 Both of those conspiracies I mentioned are Antisemitic and come from the concept of Cultural Bolshevism (A K.A. Cultural Marxism) whereby the Enemy (Historically, Jews and Blacks, but Contemporary usage also includes BLM, Antifa, Liberals 'Also conflated with Leftists', "The Gays™", and any other Boogeyman the leaders can cook up.), is this Powerful Elite Group (who is also easy to defeat by just removing the "leaders" from power.) who control all Media and Banks.

@Heucuva8 This makes them an acceptable moral target for their Rage. What's really happening is the Rich on the Left AND Right are siphoning money from their pockets, while blaming it on the Enemy, causing the culture war we see today. Make the peasants fight, and they'll never notice you picking their pockets.

@Heucuva8 in any event, thank you so much for trying to help me understand & spending the time to explain. i still don't get it but maybe it's not rational & it's not really get-able.

@singlemaltgirl @Heucuva8 Chiming in. Great explanations, but I expect no less from @Heucuva8. In addition to all that, Americans display a fundamental ignorance of politics and government. We collectively have a tendency to dismiss it all as “both sides do it” to avoid meaningful discussion. Ask the average American to define communism or socialism and they’ll probably tell you they’re the same thing.